#47 Personal Finance, PR and AI: Why Real Experts Matter with Kara Gammell

Steph:

We are thrilled to be joined today by Kara Gammell, Senior Editorial Strategy Lead and Brand Spokesperson at MoneySuperMarket. Kara is an award-winning personal finance journalist who started out with eight years on the money desk at The Daily Telegraph before going freelance and writing for The Sunday Times, The Guardian, The Independent and Good Housekeeping. She writes the weekly Bargain Hunter column for Metro, and you’ll have also heard her on BBC’s Rip-Off Britain, BBC Money Box, ITV News and Times Radio.

Today, we’re going to be talking about everything from writing Your Money or Your Life content in the age of AI, to the value of having a real human expert spokesperson, and what journalists are looking for now that long-form content is making a comeback. Kara, welcome to the show and thank you so much for joining us.

Kara:

That’s a great little intro.

Steve:

Thank you. Amazing intro, an amazing career. I want to do a bit of digging into that. How did you go from the Telegraph, to freelance, then on to MoneySuperMarket? How did you go from writing about personal finance to being the face?

Kara:

Well, it’s funny, because when I started at the Telegraph, it was my first job out of journalism school, which I did here in Brighton, actually. When I got hired at the Telegraph, the only thing I knew about money was that I didn’t have any. I remember when they called me, and it was still back in the day where you saw job adverts in the paper, like on the Monday in The Guardian. And I was thinking, I don’t know anything, but I’ll give it a go. But my editor who hired me always said that you can learn the stuff about money, but what you can’t learn is how to explain it in a way that people find accessible and easy to understand, but also relatable. And that really stuck with me.

So I worked on the money desk for eight years, and just a few months after I started working there, the Northern Rock thing happened.

Steve:

Yeah.

Kara:

And then personal finance stories went from being in the supplements in the money section to the front of the book and the news pages. So it was a really good experience. And then the internet happened, and then everything became much faster.

Steve:

I like that, “then the internet happened.”

Kara:

Then it became web first. But I had a baby, and so I decided to go freelance after that, because newsrooms are a lot of things, but they’re not necessarily predictable. If a story breaks, it can be difficult to say, “I have to go and pick up my daughter at nursery.”

I started freelancing after that and did it for about seven years, enjoying the flexibility it gave me and being able to work with so many different publications, which was really educational in itself, because everywhere worked differently and I was only used to the Telegraph. Then I decided to go back into full-time work after I got separated, and I ended up doing spokesperson work and editorial strategy. And the great thing is, I went from interrogating companies and brands about their products and services, to now getting to interrogate the brand before the story goes out, which is quite satisfying because all the data is there and it’s great.

Steph:

I’m so excited to have you on, because you’ve got this background of being a full-time reporter at the Telegraph, then the freelance angle, which is a different game, and now sitting on our side and pitching in. Like you said, the internet started, and we’ve had so much disruption within our careers. What would you say are the key things that have remained true for a good PR story to land, despite social, disruption and AI?

Kara:

Yeah. Well, a lot of the time we think faster is better. But what I think is more important is accurate, relatable “news you can use,” which is a phrase I always use. Because people don’t just want to know how much more expensive things are. They want to know what they can actually do about it. If you always keep that in the back of your mind when you’re writing about money, then it’s: how can somebody actually read this and come out of it with an action to take?

And when the Telegraph went web first, and now with AI, I do think you’ve got to get on board or get left behind. But you just need to use it in a way that helps you do your job more efficiently. It will never take the place of what you’re actually doing.

Steve:

You mentioned disruption. There’s obviously been a lot of disruption in pretty much all industries with the rise of AI. We’re just going to do a little definition, because it’s YMYL. What does that mean?

Kara:

That’s Your Money or Your Life.

Steve:

Your Money or Your Life, okay.

Kara:

Yeah. So that is what Google considers any content that could affect someone’s wellbeing, whether it’s mental, financial or physical wellbeing. The more accurate it is, and the higher authority you have, the better you rank. That’s the easy way to explain it, I guess.

Steve:

Now we have AI, people are going to AI for financial advice, and often it’s coming from an unnamed, uncredited source. How do you feel about that, given your career path and your expertise? What are the perils? I think we probably all do it. I was remortgaging recently and asking Claude for advice and going, “That sounds good.” And then it’s like, well, actually, I have no idea where it’s got this information from. What’s your take on it?

Kara:

Well, my brain is constantly going a million miles an hour about different things, so I love instant gratification if I’m curious about something. I like to look at the AI Overviews you get on Google. It’s a bit like, who doesn’t love a bit of Doctor Google? If you have an ailment, or your child does, it might give you an idea of what it is, but it doesn’t take the place of going to see your GP.

Steve:

Yeah. Okay.

Kara:

So that’s how I look at it. It can be a good starting point, but nobody should automatically believe everything they read. Just because it’s on the internet doesn’t mean it’s true. It’s always important to take it as a starting position. It’s a bit like an enthusiastic intern, if you’ve worked with one. They’re really great at gathering all the information, but you need some expertise to look at how it all joins up, what it actually means and whether it’s relevant.

Because if information about finance or your personal finances is ninety percent correct, but ten percent incorrect, and that’s about a tax level or any kind of eligibility, or it has the wrong year in it, then the whole thing isn’t useful.

Steve:

Yeah. So what would your recommendation be? I’m going to give you a specific scenario. The Budget is coming up, right? I always read it, and I find it quite interesting, but I understand maybe 70% of it, and then there’s 30% where I have no idea what it means, or what it means for me, particularly with regards to savings accounts and things like that. I see AI as a gift, but a curse. So you can go, “Right, I’m interested in changing my savings accounts and doing what’s best for me at this moment,” and start with AI. But what’s the next stage after that? Is it reading up in places with more integrity, consulting a financial adviser? What’s the journey at the moment?

Kara:

Look at AI a bit like Wikipedia. One thing students are always told is never to use Wikipedia if you’re writing a paper, because anybody can write anything. I’ve actually done talks in secondary schools about how to use Google effectively, and one of the things I say is, fine, if you can’t resist Wikipedia, read it, but then look at the footnotes at the bottom, where that information came from, and visit the direct link.

Steve:

Sure.

Kara:

So perhaps there’s a statement about something, and in the footnotes it links to the BBC. Well, then go there and start reading that. So it’s like a port of call, a way to focus you a bit. The main thing is that AI is really tricky. My AI at work, I swear, just compliments me all the time.

Kara:

Yes.

Steve:

Have you set it up specifically to do that?

Kara:

And I don’t know if it just knows that I’m thirsty or what. But it’s like, “Well, that’s a great question.” Everything’s aggressive.

Steph:

That’s so…

Kara:

Yeah. And it’s like, “And I’m going to answer it in a way that I know you like, which is empowering,” and blah, blah, blah. So sometimes I feel like you can be in an echo chamber, and it’s telling you the things it knows you want to hear. So when it comes to something like the Budget, sure, use AI Overviews as a starting point, but then it’s important to look at the sources they always have linked in the bullet points. Do you recognise them? If you do, then go there for further guidance.

Steph:

That’s so interesting, because at the minute, with the citations and mentions that brands are getting, there are some reputable ones and then some really rogue ones in there as well.

Kara:

Yeah. The thing with AI is that it gives you a really quick answer, but the downside is it can look really convincing. You just need to bear in mind that you wouldn’t take advice from a stranger on the street. You need to go to someone who knows what they’re doing. It’s a bit like using Google to check out symptoms you might have. You wouldn’t then take a prescription from Google. You need to go to your GP, who actually went to medical school.

Steve:

Makes sense.

Steph:

You are the GP in the personal finance context.

Kara:

I’m going to tell that to my sister, who is a GP. She would think that was funny.

Steph:

Do you and your team use AI in your content production, or are there hard boundaries as to where the human has to come in?

Kara:

Yeah, we do use AI, because I think it’s a way of working efficiently and doing things faster. The most important thing is that AI shouldn’t take the place of a human. As a spokesperson, it’s all well and good having my picture and my name on things, but I never put out a quote that I haven’t read, because at the end of the day, I don’t ever want to be viewed as giving advice when I’m not regulated to do so.

It’s important to always have a second set of eyes, human ones, on everything, and not rely on AI. It shouldn’t take the place of a human, but it can be like the really enthusiastic intern who helps you focus your thought process. I find it really useful, because I’m so curious about everything all the time. I have ADHD, and I’ve known since I was twenty-three. So I’m an ADHD elder, because I’ve known I’ve had it for twenty-three years.

I’ve tried everything, but I find it really does help me focus on what the end result is. Sometimes I’ll put what I’ve written through it and say, “Detect any unconscious bias that I might have.”

Steph:

That’s a nice question.

Kara:

And I always say, “Then highlight every single suggestion in bold and strikethrough, and explain why you’ve done it.” Then I can read it, and I feel like I’m learning at the same time.

Steph:

That’s a very nice use.

Steve:

So, as a money GP, a personal finance GP, let’s delve into your personal finances. Not in detail, just a broad-brush overview. Do you ever use AI to get advice on your investments or your savings? How does the advice stack up? Have you ever been advised something that’s dangerous or risky? Because I’m fascinated by where the future’s going. This is high-stakes stuff, it just is.

Kara:

So I use AI for everything.

Steph:

Which is your preferred tool? Because I know if I ask Claude a question, sometimes it pushes back, like, “Ethically, I can’t do this.” And then I go to ChatGPT and it’s like, “Sure.”

Kara:

Yeah, I use ChatGPT for personal stuff and when I’m out and about, but at work I use Copilot.

Steph:

Okay.

Kara:

I use it for lots of things in my personal life. I love it to help me complain effectively, because it’s really easy to get so upset about something that you forget what you’re actually asking for. I’ve used it on a number of occasions to complain effectively, and it has worked. Then I’ve taken their response, which I was unhappy with, put it back in and said, “Help me respond to this and focus on the outcome I’ve requested.” That really streamlined it. I did it in half an hour and got a result I felt really good about.

Steph:

And it removes so much of the mental load as well.

Kara:

It does. And I always think that if you’re busy, and I have a full-time job and I’m a solo parent, there’s always something else to do and things just fall down the list. But it’s really worth doing.

Steph:

When you talk about complaining, is that to a brand, about a service, like customer service?

Kara:

Yes. If there was something fundamentally wrong. I know my consumer rights, and I know what is acceptable and what isn’t. But I’ve rewritten letters and thought to myself, “I sound like I went to law school.”

Steph:

I do wonder how the brand customer service teams are feeling.

Kara:

Stressed. Yeah, I feel like they probably have an avalanche of that. My friends who are teachers say they’re getting a lot of emails from parents written with AI as well, and it’s quite obvious. So I always say at the end, “Rewrite this in a version that doesn’t make it sound like AI wrote it.” That’s one way.

I also use it for planning holidays. My daughter and I always go to a capital city, or any European city really, every November for my birthday. I tell it our ages, what we like to do, where we want to fly from and when we’re going, and it’ll suggest places from Gatwick, because that’s the nearest airport to me. I’ll explain my budget, and it’ll help me do an outline of where I want to go. So instead of going to Lapland, we’re going to Tromsø in Norway, because it’s more affordable and more appropriate for a thirteen-year-old.

So that really helps. But I don’t just book whatever AI tells me to. I use it as my outline and then I go away and do it. But when it comes to personal finances like my investments or my daughter’s investments… my daughter even has a pension.

Steve:

What? You’re doing a pension?

Kara:

Yeah. It’s amazing.

Steph:

Could a baby have a pension?

Kara:

Yeah, just like a Junior ISA. I only set it up last year.

Steve:

I’ve missed out on six years already.

Kara:

Well, it’s never too late. We did some research about the sandwich generation, and how typically women are looking after elderly relatives but also their children, because people are having babies at an older age, or it could be grandkids. They’re feeling really stressed, and they don’t realise how much unpaid work they’re providing. It was for a life insurance story we were doing. And I thought to myself, I have an only child and I don’t have a partner. Gosh, she’ll be a lone sandwich generation looking after me. So I thought, what might soften the blow of her having to look after me when I’m old is if I help her out with her pension now to fill that gap. So that’s what I’ve been doing.

Steve:

That’s amazing, because I had no idea about that, and this is proving the point we’re making. AI can be great if you know how to prompt it and what you’re looking for, and it can give you that broad overview. But it wouldn’t have given me that information. Coming to an actual expert can give you that.

Steph:

The lived experience.

Kara:

Yeah. And what you could do is go into AI and… so I was looking at my benefits at work, thinking about which cash plan I wanted. We have contacts and glasses and dentists and all of this stuff, and there are different levels. I put in what my daughter and I need, that we both wear contacts, and so on, and it helped me realise which level was more valuable. The higher levels were for things like going to a chiropractor and really sports-related things that I wouldn’t need, like sports massages. So it helped me figure out what was best value for my personal use, and that helped me focus.

But personally, I wouldn’t use AI instead of seeking financial advice about investments or anything like that, because I’m not even regulated to give that information. I think it’s a good place to do some research, and maybe say, “I’ve got two kids aged six and three. What could I do to help them get off on the right foot financially? What could I do now? And where could I go for more information?”

Steve:

They could get jobs, though.

Kara:

They could, yeah. I know they don’t do paper rounds anymore like they did in my day.

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Steph:

Speaking about the value of having a real human expert, you and Alicia at MoneySuperMarket are both named, credited spokespeople. Obviously, having that in the age of AI is more important. But have you had examples of having real, credited humans in the byline really helping push a story through better than it might have otherwise?

Kara:

Yeah. Just the simple fact that with some journalists, you now have to confirm your identity with them in a telephone call.

Steph:

Yes.

Kara:

I’ve had that more and more. With the actual journalist, even if I’ve already confirmed it with that publication. Particularly if they’re not in personal finance journalism, so they don’t know your name.

Steph:

I was going to say, that’s the beauty of your career, that a lot of people are like, “Yeah.”

Kara:

Yeah, exactly. But occasionally you’ll see lifestyle journalists writing a bit more about the cost of living. I’d never had to confirm my identity until this year. LinkedIn isn’t enough. And I think it’s really good that that’s happening, because anybody can write five hundred words on something with AI. I mean, look at me with my complaints about a holiday. But the difference is having someone standing behind it who has checked it. When it comes to a spokesperson, I always say my name and my face are on that comment. So I have skin in the game as well, not just from a brand perspective, but for my own personal brand. And I think journalists know that I would never suggest something that I didn’t actually believe was accurate, fair, balanced and in the best interest of consumers, because I wouldn’t risk my career over it.

Steph:

I’m so fascinated by this, because we know how important it is now to have a real human expert. So I wonder, with brands hiring into their in-house marketing teams, is it a better move to hire someone with journalism experience as a brand person, or to train up someone junior in the team?

Kara:

I think it’s useful to have both. I came in with twenty years of experience, but also twenty years of being on Google, basically, which I often say to my colleague Alicia, who I work with and is younger than me. I’m like, “You can’t help that you’re fifteen years younger than me.” That’s one thing you can’t change: how many articles are out there with your name on them over a certain period of time.

So it’s useful to have someone who comes from journalism, because I do think it helps open doors. And I still think of myself as a journalist, because that’s what I am at heart, so I know what the journalist interviewing me needs.

Steph:

Yeah.

Kara:

I know you can’t just answer the first question. You need to be ready with the backup, the next questions, and then offer something extra they can take away, because you want to make their life easier and help them get the information they need. And I think it really makes a difference when you have your personal reputation involved as well.

Steph:

That’s so valuable now in terms of recruitment. I know there’s sometimes a natural career path from journalism to PR, but it feels like skipping PR and going in-house marketing is a good move.

Kara:

Yeah, I think so. I remember when I started at MoneySuperMarket, I was like, “Well, my background isn’t PR. I haven’t done that for twenty years. But what I do know is what’s a good story.” And so they created the role of Editorial Strategy Lead. I help create stories that I think will pass what I call the barbecue test: would people actually discuss this at a barbecue? And I think the barbecue test ages me, because it shows I’m not at the pub.

Steph:

That would work just as well now, the pub chat, wouldn’t it?

Kara:

Exactly. Would my friends who aren’t in personal finance journalism want to discuss it? Is it affecting them? If it passes that, then I think that’s a great place for a story. And then I work with our agencies and our in-house team on developing the story a bit further, so we really get the bang for our buck.

Steve:

What’s the hardest thing about the role of editorial strategist and brand spokesperson? What do you find most challenging?

Kara:

I want to do everything, because so many things are interesting. I know that’s like, “Of course she’s going to say that,” but I genuinely do. And I think you know, Steph, that I get really excited about things.

Steph:

Never.

Kara:

Things that I think are really interesting and helpful. Every now and then I’ll just put in our group chats, “I just happened to see this,” and it’s always, “We don’t need to do it now, but mull it over for later.” So that’s one thing. But that’s also the old ADHD that I have.

Steph:

It’s not even annoying, because it’s wonderful to be peppered with those ideas, and they’re actually the ones that perform best.

Kara:

Thank you.

Steph:

They can’t be ignored.

Kara:

Yeah, thank you very much. But the other thing is, as a spokesperson, you can only do one thing at a time. So while I’m here at a podcast, I can’t be answering other things. Sometimes there are demands for me to comment on lots of different things simultaneously, but I can only speak about one thing at a time.

The other thing is the invisible preparation. If you’re going on BBC London and it’s a ten-minute slot, there’s getting to the studio, getting into the studio, but also being prepared for all of the potential questions, so you’re not on the spot when you’re there. Because the thing with radio is it’s all recorded visually now, so you can’t just have a laptop there and Google what the interest rate is.

Steve:

There’s a lot of prep that goes into it, isn’t there? We get asked about the podcast quite a lot, and you have to put the work in to think of the questions, make sure everyone’s comfortable and everything’s set up in the right way. People miss that. I think people who don’t work in PR or marketing think you just rock up and have a chat. It’s like, no.

Kara:

No. And then it’s a case of saying, “Okay, I’m going to do this now. Can somebody else hold the fort while I’m doing it?” Because I know myself that I can get distracted, and I just want to keep my head in the game.

But to be honest, the thing about my job, what I realise, is I get to do all the things I really like to do, and the things I didn’t enjoy, I don’t have to do now. More the admin or the Excel. I get to review things and come up with the ideas, and then somebody does the research and I get to take it from there. So I know it’s a real sweet spot. I’m really lucky.

Steph:

You’ve earned it. I know what we get measured on when we’re reporting in PR, but as a spokesperson, what do you say in your mid-year review to prove the value you’re adding to the business? What are your objectives?

Kara:

The thing is, there’s nobody else in my company who does what I do, and they didn’t really have anyone like me before, or at least not that I know of. So it can be a bit of a grey area, but we look at lots of different things. There’s digital PR, doing interviews and developing relationships with journalists, whether that’s the FT or the Press Association. And then how many times that relationship leads to me being asked again. When I get approached personally rather than through one of our agencies, that’s really helpful as well. We can monitor that and see all the headlines.

There’s also broadcast and social media, and I do lots of company events. With my job, it’s all very visible, because as a spokesperson it’s all promoted, so it’s pretty easy to make a list of it. But it’s more about how I’m bringing extra value to the business, not just as a person who goes out and talks about it, but by developing relationships and bringing authority to different places, whether it’s print, online, emails or socials. How can we try to be everywhere all at once, but maintain that level of quality?

Steph:

It’s hard. It does blow my mind how busy your day is all the time. You’re on show as well. So thank you. We didn’t do it on the 28th. We didn’t do it on Budget day.

My final question in this area: outside of your own industry, are there any brands or particular spokespeople where you’re like, “They’re working hard. I can see them”? Is there a WhatsApp thread?

Kara:

I mean, the obvious one is Martin Lewis. He’s everywhere and doing such good work. And MONY Group does own MoneySavingExpert, so I see behind the scenes as well. He’s not a one-person show. He has a staff of people all working together to enable him to take all the opportunities. There’s constantly something, and you think, “That’s a good idea.” So I would say he’s the top tier.

Steph:

Top tier.

Kara:

But I do think we’re seeing a bit more of spokespeople coming out in brands. And the idea is to keep trying to bring something really unique that I can provide that another spokesperson can’t. I can talk for days.

Steve:

Which is why we had you on the show.

Kara:

Thank you. My daughter likes to remind me. She’s thirteen and very confident.

Steph:

Where does she get that from?

Kara:

I don’t know. She likes to remind me that I’m paid to talk at work as a spokesperson, but I don’t always need to give my opinions constantly at home.

Steve:

Do you just come in and…

Kara:

Well, I am a mum. That’s my job too, it’s the unpaid one.

Steve:

We’ve talked a lot about changes in the industry and how AI is forcing some of that. For a while, we’ve probably all been aware that churnalism, that low-effort, reactive, sensationalist, clickbaity stuff, has been a fairly dominant model. You were talking about journalists ringing you up to verify you’re an expert, which is one really positive change. But have you noticed any other changes to that model in the age of AI? Are we seeing the return of longer-form content? Is that a good thing? I’ve asked a question in three parts there.

Kara:

That’s okay. That’s my favourite kind of question. Absolutely. I look back to when I was at the Telegraph and it was a supplement in the paper, on a Saturday and a Sunday. Then the Telegraph went web first, so it went from doing three features a week to suddenly so many words all the time. It was constant, because everybody wanted to be first, first, first. And that comes at an expense, I think, for quality. That was fifteen years ago. Now media outlets are looking for quality over quantity, thank goodness, and some longer-form content as well.

But there’s also so much video. I was filming presentations at home yesterday, and I thought, I never thought this is what I would also be doing. I wasn’t a broadcaster to begin with, but there’s a lot of filming in very different mediums. It’s about how to reach people where they are, whether that’s social or embedded videos, and all of those take time. It’s hard to churn out videos when you’re one person. And I always think, and it’s old school again because I’m used to newspapers, I say that, but I left there thirteen years ago…

Steve:

There you go.

Kara:

But I always think, would I pay a freelancer for all of those words on the page if I was paying them per word, had a budget and was an editor? So how can you say what you want to say in the fewest words, but be very clear about it? That takes time as well. It’s much easier to ramble on if you’re churning things out. People were used to short-form content on social media and things. But when you read the news, you want to know immediately what is happening and what it means for you, rather than any kind of waffle.

Steph:

As I’ve got older, my social media feed is filled with more personal finance, probably since meeting you. And it’s so dense. It’s really dense information coming at you ever so quickly, and it can feel overwhelming.

Kara:

Yeah. How would I explain it to my girlfriends? If we were talking about something, I wouldn’t just start going on about pensions. I would talk about the free pension money you can get from your employer. You wouldn’t turn down a Christmas bonus, so don’t turn down that free pension money, those contributions. It’s about making it bite-size. But doing that takes time.

Steph:

You have to know which bits…

Kara:

Yeah, which you can trim. So I think we are seeing that. And as budgets are cut, there’s less resourcing at media outlets as well, there are fewer people. So I think churnalism is on its way out.

Steve:

That’s good. As a slight aside, I’m just interested in this. You mentioned chatting to your girlfriends. Coming back to the GP thing, I’ve got a friend who’s a GP, and sometimes I go to her with a little medical thing. She absolutely loves it.

Kara:

She loves that. My sister’s the same.

Steve:

Our friendship is fading as a result. But do you get people coming to you with questions?

Kara:

All the time.

Steve:

How annoying is that on a scale of one to…

Kara:

I don’t find it annoying, actually, because I’m pretty laid back, and I like people who are also curious. I like curious people. What I don’t find as satisfying is story ideas. I rented an office in a co-working space, and it was just me and a bunch of men in their late sixties. They were all consultants, and they just loved to tell me their ideas all the time.

Steph:

They wanted validation.

Kara:

Yeah. And while they were great, they weren’t necessarily the demographic I was writing for, and I only had a day a week outside of the baby. But then again, every now and then there is a good one, so I would never say don’t tell me.

But a lot of the time, people will ask me questions they probably already know the answers to, they just don’t feel confident. And talking about it with someone else helps create confidence. If you feel more confident, you feel more empowered. It’s a bit like how I don’t like cooking and I’m a terrible cook. One thing that really rattles me is doing a big meal for a lot of people. Put me live on TV, but Thanksgiving dinner on my own, because I’m Canadian, I get really rattled, because I’m not confident in the kitchen. And I think that’s how a lot of people feel about their finances.

So I like to say I’m not regulated to give financial advice. I throw that in a lot. But I can signpost where you can go. I talk about my daughter’s investment portfolio in her Junior ISA, or her pension, but I would never recommend a fund or anything like that, because I’m not the person to do that.

Steve:

Okay, that makes sense.

Steph:

I know from working with you that MoneySuperMarket is so fantastic at turning comment around very quickly. And although we’ve spoken about churnalism dying off, the need for speed is still very much there. It’s fantastic working with you because that’s not a blocker. For some other clients, it can be. So what advice do you have for marketing teams, especially in personal finance and other heavily regulated industries, to help them be more reactive to the news cycle?

Kara:

Compliance is a massive issue for brands, particularly in financial services. You can’t say you will save money. You have to say you may save money, because whatever we say or the content we put out could inform someone’s financial decisions, and we don’t ever want anyone to make a decision that’s not right for them based on something we’ve said. So I think it’s about building compliance into the whole relationship.

If I was working with a new agency, which I’ve done in the past with you guys, I’d say, “Let’s do a little session on what all these products are.” We did one about life insurance, I think, covering the things to be careful of. Just don’t assume that everyone has the knowledge. And I always think you can’t expect an agency to be faster or better if you don’t explain why you made a change. So often I’ll explain in a note, “It’s never ‘whilst,’ it’s always ‘while.'” I’m not trying to be patronising, but I can’t expect someone to read my mind and know why a change has happened. Over time, there are fewer corrections, because you’ve developed that relationship.

It also helps to have really clear deadlines, or invisible deadlines set by the agency if somebody isn’t particularly fast at responding on the client end. It’s about being prepared. We’re really big on responding quickly, because that’s what we do. And over time, you develop trust with the people you’re working with at the agency, and that makes a difference. We’re all on Teams together, so we’re able to just nudge people. I always say, “Nudge me.” I don’t take offence, I welcome it, because I know what I’m like. I say that right off the bat, so nobody feels like, “Ooh, I don’t want to ask her that, because she’s the client.”

So I think it helps to be really honest, and for clients working with agencies to be approachable. I always say there’s no such thing as a stupid question, and I really do believe that. I’ll never eye-roll and think, “Why did somebody ask me that?” Because they wouldn’t ask if they knew. Yes, they might be able to self-serve, but sometimes it’s just quicker to ask someone. Over time, that helps speed things up.

Steph:

Yeah, I think how available you make yourself to me and the team is the key, and that would be the advice I’d give to other in-house marketing teams, where they might gatekeep a spokesperson or the legal team. Whereas if you have that direct access, you can just go into your DMs and be like, “Is this okay?”

Kara:

And I think that makes such a difference, because then you enter into a conversation and a relationship where you start to build trust. Back in the day at the Telegraph, we used to go out for lunches a lot. It was the good old days. My editor, Ian Cowie, and all these years later I still use so many of the things he drummed into me, always said it’s really useful for people to be able to put a face to a name, not just in a picture, but by speaking to someone. Because once you see someone as another person, it feels really different.

That’s why it’s really important for spokespeople to be involved with the agencies and everybody putting out content. From my point of view, you’ve got my byline, my name and my photo, and you’re trying to find opportunities. But by creating that trust, I know you’re never going to suggest anything that you think I wouldn’t do, because you know what I would and wouldn’t do now.

Steph:

Yeah, exactly.

Kara:

And I think that makes it so much quicker, too.

Steve:

Well, talking of speed, we’re now going to test how quickly you can react with some quick-fire wrap-up questions. Is that okay?

Kara:

Okay, yeah, sure.

Steve:

What is one personal finance myth you wish would die? It’s quite a strong question to start with, isn’t it?

Kara:

That’s a really hard one. That investments are scary and you have to be rich to start. We actually did some research which shows people think about it for four years before they start investing.

Steph:

Wow.

Kara:

Yeah. And they think they need about £4,700 to get started, but you can start with a pound. Everyone thinks you have to be the Wolf of Wall Street or a millionaire, but investing is just a different type of saving.

Steve:

That’s a good one.

Steph:

What’s your favourite campaign that you’ve been involved in?

Kara:

I’ve got so many. But one I feel quite passionate about is the unpaid work calculator we did. Women in particular underestimate the value they bring home, because they’re not necessarily bringing home a paycheque. But all of the childcare, the cooking, the cleaning, chauffeuring your kids here, there and everywhere, would cost something if you were unable to provide it.

So we made a calculator using ONS data where you can put in how many hours of each of those things you do and find out how much it would cost to pay someone to do it if you were dead or incapacitated. And I feel like that’s quite empowering for a lot of women.

Steve:

If you weren’t in journalism or brand comms, what would you be doing? Would it be learning to cook better, for example?

Kara:

Yeah. I really like interiors.

Steve:

Okay.

Kara:

I’d love to flip houses. Well, not flip houses, but something like that.

Steph:

Property development.

Kara:

Yeah. Something from the creative point of view. I don’t think I’d want to be balancing the books, but I would like to do something like that, I think.

Steve:

What do you make of the interiors of the studio? Because we were talking about the cushions pre-recording.

Kara:

Very comfortable. I appreciate the two inserts in this one. The lighting is complimentary. We love lots of layers.

Steve:

It’s nice, isn’t it? Do you have one more quick question?

Steph:

I think it might be an interesting one. What are some of the more intriguing, weird or funny perils of being a brand spokesperson?

Kara:

Well, one thing I didn’t anticipate is that now my daughter’s thirteen, her friends see me doing things.

Steph:

Of course.

Kara:

Yeah. There’s a TikTok of me running through a train platform pulling a suitcase, wearing a tweed jacket. It was a lip sync, apparently. So I pop up in so many different places, not just for the people who read the paper or the money sections. It’s now someone in Audrey’s class saying, “I saw your mum talking about how teens are charging their vapes hidden in their stuffed animals.” And Audrey’s like, “Why did you… I told you that!”

Steph:

Is she your sign-off mystery?

Kara:

Yeah. We’ve done stuff with Audrey before, and I’m like, I have to get complete sign-off. So what I didn’t anticipate was the feedback, not just from my teenager, but from other teenagers.

Steve:

That’s a lot to contend with. Kara, thank you so much for joining us. It’s been an absolute pleasure. If people want to get in touch with you to pepper you with their own personal finance questions, how would they do that?

Kara:

I’m available on social media, Instagram and LinkedIn, or via the MoneySuperMarket website, and you can contact me there. There’s no one else who actually has my name, so I’m pretty easy to find.

Steve:

Nice. We’ll go and do that. Thank you so much for your time. It’s been an absolute pleasure.